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A Civil Religious Debate


Cartman's Waterfall RSS

This personal waterfall shows you all of Cartman's arguments, looking across every debate.
1 point

Sorry, but premise 1 is faulty. There is no way of knowing if God is actually possible.

1 point

Just like Christians I didn't read your bible passages.

2 points

You aren't sure how dying 2 different ways is a contradiction?

1 point

Next time just say you can't do it.

1 point

So, since the stories on the Bible fit the scenario of liars, why do you believe it?

1 point

Matthew 27:5

Saying, 'I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood'. And they said, 'What is that to us? See thou to that.'

So Judas threw the money into the temple and left. Then he went away and hanged himself.

Acts 1:18

With the payment he received for his wickedness, Judas bought a field; there he fell headlong, his body burst open and all his intestines spilled out.

I can find some more for you, but can you explain how someone can hang themselves if their intestines have spilled out?

2 points

There are inconsistencies in the Bible making it suspect as a piece of evidence. Saints are just nice people. Miracles are natural occurrences. The Bible provides several explanations that cannot be backed up with scientific data. Fossils, DNA, and geology all show the accounts in the Bible are false.

2 points

He didn't state an opinion, he stated a fact about what other people believe. Obviously my opinion is valid if he is going to make a statement about my opinion. Learn to read.

1 point

Show me this "section".

-None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar: Knowest thou not that Allah Hath power over all things?

If there aren't contradictions, why do you have substitutions in the Quran?

You are speaking of looking through the Quran for the creation of modern medicine, through a biological process, in a specific manner. If the Quran were to list every possible way of surgery and medicine and healing, as well as every minute detail of every single aspect of our lives, it would be an encyclopedia and not a Holy Book stating not how to do every little thing in our lives, but the morals and laws we should live by.

Dude, you can't defend the scientific knowledge in the Quran and also remind everyone there is no scientific knowledge in the Quran. It doesn't need to be a complete encyclopedia. Just one thing from Allah with perfect scientific detail would have been great.

Firstly, who are you to tell me how to use books, let alone Holy ones?

Who are you to tell me how to use books? You gave the incorrect way to use your book. Evidence: "but the morals and laws we should live by" you admitting it isn't about truth.

Second, why can't being a better person be part of truth? Are you saying that being a better person is only related to "fiction", and that rational people are not good people, and don't strive to be better?

I didn't say anything like that. Being a better person does not have to be based on truth. It can be, but in the case of religious texts it isn't supposed to be. They are stories to illustrate points. All I was saying is that one does not lead to the other or vice versa. I made no comment about rational people. It was actually irrational for you to bring that up.

1 point

I mean to tell you that I am a human of rationality.

Instead of telling me, actually act rational.

However, having looked into the Quran, I found that there are no contradictions, no vile thoughts or views. Not only that, but I found that it contained scientific breakthroughs that had only been discovered recently, while the Book had been written 1400 years back.

There is a section in the Quran that tells you if any part of the Quran contradicts itself use the later portion.

People may complain that the scientific knowledge in the Book are too "vague", but if one has it in his mind to disbelieve, he will.

If one has in his mind that he would like to know how biological processes work in a specific manner so that he can create modern medicine, he will avoid the vague Quran.

One must look upon the Books (Bible, Torah, Quran) in search of truth, not anything else.

You are using books that are supposed to help you be a better person, not to deliver the truth. You are using it wrong.

2 points

The thing about God is that we cannot find any proof that he is not there.

She was saying that. She meant both sides.

But, that is a ridiculous concept. You are making a claim that He exists. It is up to you to provide something that shows He exists. It isn't up to us to determine everything that doesn't exist. It is impossible to disprove every imaginary being that people come up with.

1 point

I believe it is a set of mere coincidences with a mechanism to keep good coincidences. No being created this beautiful system.

Boom, proved you wrong.

1 point

I don't know if you're aware, but saturn's moon, Titan, is not in fact, Earth. As two completely separate bodies in space, they are entitled to different ages.

Oh dang, that is a really good point.

3 points

I will try to help you out here.

Amino Acids can not randomly combine to create protein molecule

This is more or less false. There have been experiments that were able to demonstrate that nucleobases and amino acids can form spontaneously. We can't rule out proteins being able to form.

more or less a living cell.

This is a massive jump in the evolutionary cycle so it seems incredibly difficult to imagine the possibility. Over the course of millions of years simple molecules can become more complex. The problem you have with a cell is that you assume it is done randomly. A cell isn't created randomly now, and the very first cell wouldn't have to be a random event where the molecules all came together. The smaller "complex" molecules that have been forming for many many years could have created it in a "designed" way that is less random.

No known natural process can explain the generation of the first living things on earth.

But, just because it isn't known yet doesn't mean God did it.

The natural creation of even the molecules to create life violates the laws of thermodynamics.

This misconception comes from not recognizing the Earth is not a closed system. The Earth receives energy from the sun. Any life that spontaneously forms could have received its energy from the sun, directly or indirectly. Plus, the Earth's core contains a massive amount of energy that can be harnessed.

Without organization, the creation of a single protein has the same odds as a tornado going through a scrapyard and assembling a working Boeing 747.

This is true for a specific protein. If you pick any protein around today, the odds are insurmountable. But, if we talk about any possible protein chain, including incredibly small proteins, the odds become very likely.

See the Law of Biogenesis.

The law of Biogenesis is not as rock solid as you seem to believe. No one has proven that it is impossible for life to come from non life in all cases. With one act of abiogenesis where small nucleotides and amino acids formed spontaneously you have the life needed for the law of biogenesis to be valid.

Scientific laws essentially prove the existence of a higher power.

The higher power would have to break the law of biogenesis as well, so you haven't fixed anything.

3 points

Objective morality doesn't exist.

The cosmological argument doesn't help you. The start of the universe does not have to be because of God.

No evidence of fine tuning.

1 point

Your flaw is toward the very beginning.

no such thing as time before the big bang which of course makes sense

You are speculating on what happened before the first moment of the universe. We don't do that for anything else. We are satisfied with the first moment being the first moment for EVERYTHING else.



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